Cathy Barry

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Pierluigi
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Joined: Aug 25 2000

I cannot believe my eyes!! I have just got hold of the latest copy of CV and was absolutely shocked to see a quarter page ad for a Porn Actress, offering her services, not only that but there was a web page address which led to not only just a porn site but a HARD CORE porn site, with very explicit images that did not require any credit card checks or membership to view.

My son who is 11 years old reads my copy of CV, I let him because I've always considered the mag safe, but now there is no way I will even let him near it. I personally think that it is postively outrageous that such an advertisement would be allowed in what up until now I considered a very respectible magazine.

I can only hope that this was a very unfortunate error by your ad selling department and that no further ads of this nature will appear in future issues.

Regards

Lui

RVS
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Joined: Nov 4 2000

I notice you know where the site leads to though,you couldn`t resist taking a peek eh!
Did you follow ALL those links?

Anonymous

I refer the honourble gentleman to my previous.....

[This message has been edited by Chaifox (edited 08 May 2001).]

Pierluigi
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quote:Originally posted by RVS:
I notice you know where the site leads to though,you couldn`t resist taking a peek eh!
Did you follow ALL those links?

I totally resent that remark!!! Clearly you are not a parent, otherwise you would not have made such stupid remark. I followed the link to see what my 11 year old son would have been subjected to, if he had done the same, and I was totally disgusted at what was freely viewable to anyone.

While I accept that this sort of stuff exists on the net and that it's a free country and all that, but there is an appropriate place for everything and the place for this kind of advertisment is in a mag that occupys the top shelf of a newsagents, certainly not in a mag that deals with video editing.

Regards

Lui

Pierluigi
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Joined: Aug 25 2000

quote:Originally posted by Chaifox:
I refer the honourble gentleman to my previous.....

[This message has been edited by Chaifox (edited 08 May 2001).]

Thanks for pointing that one out, I had forgotten about that, at the time I couldn't understand what it was about as I had not bought the mag yet, but now I do.

Looking at the date of the post, I am very surprised that no-one at CV has said a word about it yet. Whether it was a slip-up or not, I think we deserve some sort of reply or explaination.

Well Messr's Crabtree and Wells and particularly Mr Lindsay (the Ad manager) what do you have to say for yourselves. Can we expect more of the same in the next issue? Maybe the main story on the cover had a spelling mistake and should have said "Porn again".

Regards

Lui

tim.callaghan
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Joined: Apr 4 2001

Hi Lui,

Without trying to start a flaming slang match and sound like Larry Flynt I would like to make a few points.

Yes, Cathy Barry's site has a more graphic than normal preview site (I was quite shocked). If you pick up a copy of amatuer/practical photographer you will see adverts for models and referring websites, and some of them will be explicit. Nearly all media magazines/newspapers have content leading to content like this. Take 'the Sun' etc FHM, Loaded, etc Fast Car, etc. Would you censor these publications from your son? Your son is 11, he is obviously aware of the word sex and even though beholds an immature outlook of what it's all about there's nothing to stop his curiosity going to the first search engine and typing in xxx sex...what ever. I agree, young children should not be subjected to such material until their minds are sufficiently matured to understand the responsibilities of sex. Your aim, should be to control what your son has access to, not what can be published, as this is a basic infringement on human rights. The OPA is an infringement on our human rights, to choose, and has recently changed to comply with EU law.

Obviously when minors are concerned the topic is much more sensitive, and I appreciate you being a parent and me not, that you may have stronger views on this issue and may completely disagree with me. If I was a parent I wouldn't want my Son to see images of Cathy Barry with god knows what stuffed up her, but neither would I like him to see footage of Israelis and Palestinians opening fire on each other and a father and small boy getting caught in the way. And, given the choice I would rather have my Son question me about porn and sex than trying to explain why people hate each other so much in this world that they would scatter each others brains out for a piece of land.

Protection is vital to a youths mind, but what kind of mind do we nurture when the child is raised with the idea of sex and pornography as taboo, hidden and restricted, although images and stories of horrendous violence are portrayed and screened to the same minds. Which is more acceptable? Which would you rather have accepted?

I like porn! Hate, anger, violence and war upset me. Kids can't differenciate that well between fact and fiction and so should be protected from more than what they get protected from now. That's where your control as a parent comes in. There is technology out there to restrict kiddies internet usage. So deploy it. You can't stop the media or advertising, and it would be a sad world if you could.

Again, I apologise in advance to anybody who may whole heartledly disagree with my opinions and the direction of my post is not to offend, but to merely put a different perspective on the question of contemporary beliefs.

But for now, back to 'Car Wash Angels #2'

Many Regards

Tim

[This message has been edited by tim.callaghan (edited 09 May 2001).]

[This message has been edited by tim.callaghan (edited 09 May 2001).]

Pierluigi
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Joined: Aug 25 2000

Hi Tim,

While I agree with most of what you say (and by the way, I most certainly do not allow my son to view magazines like FHM, Loaded etc as these are clearly aimed at adults, and not young children, I don't even get them myself as they hold no material of interest to me), but you are missing the point of my anger at CV. Up until now I considered CV magazine to be what I call "a safe read" for my son, he is very into computers and often plays about with my video editing equipment, and I had no objection to him grabbing my copy of CV and reading up about the subject. But now I find that I have to either rip out the offending pages, (which is what I have done to this months copy) or worse restrict his access to the publication.

I hate to have to always watch over what my son reads and sees, to have to deny him access to magazines which on the face of it look totally innocent and safe to read, but when you actually go through them are full of adverts for Adult CD-ROMS, websites and the like. But it has now unfortunately become part of the routine.

I have no objection to porn whatsoever, and believe that adults have a perfect right to view it should they wish, but there are magazines published specifically for that purpose. I don't expect to find it in a publication like CV, which has absolutely nothing to do with the subject.

But alas I guess that's the modern world for you, I'm just saddened that such a magazine like CV has degraded itself in this way. Some respect has been lost here guys.

Regards

Lui

vega1970
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Joined: Oct 10 2000

I agree with Tim,
this countrys Censorship laws are tight compared to other countries, not just with Porn but with Horror too. It's only recently that the BBFC have passed some decent Horro films to DVD. As for Children and the big wide world, well, that's the responsibility of the parents to protect them from seeing things they would not like them to see, but once in high school, and no matter how good or protective a parent you are, children will seek out on their own and find things out you may not like them to...

So long Suckas !!!

tim@work
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Joined: Apr 30 2001

Hi Lui,

This is going to be my last comment on this topic as I realise everybody has there own views, and these are hardly likely to be changed due to few posts, because most of these views are instilled by society.

You refer to CV as previously being a safe read and that it has lost respect. Again, I iterate what about all the terrible images and stories on the news, be it day time or night time. Would you consider the news not to be a 'safe' broadcast? It certainly has become more graphic and in some cases I would say disturbing.

I don't mean to criticise, but are you not more concerned about your Son being exposed to violence and war everyday than maybe a chance that he would look up Cathy Barry's assets after perusing the advert section? It must be such a hard job raising a kid in this day and age, with such readily availability of media and information.

To be honest with you, I really don't think CV were expecting kids to be reading this magazine anyhow, as I wouldn't believe this is their intended market.

Take care Lui, and good luck. It must be a daunting task, one that I would say 'rather you than me'

Tim

Unicorn
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quote:Originally posted by vega1970:
I agree with Tim,
this countrys Censorship laws are tight compared to other countries, not just with Porn but with Horror too. It's only recently that the BBFC have passed some decent Horro films to DVD.

Fortunately the BBFC is now almost irrelevant thanks to web-based DVD dealers and region-hacked players. For some of these movies (e.g. 'Straw Dogs'), 'Banned in the UK!' has even become a marketing ploy.

quote:once in high school, and no matter how good or protective a parent you are, children will seek out on their own and find things out you may not like them to...

Indeed. While I can see Lui's point, the only place I've ever seen hardcore porn magazines was in the school playground when I was that age; the Internet may have made porn more accessible, but it isn't anything new, and God knows what kids are passing around the playground these days. My parents would have had heart attacks if they'd known what we got up to.

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Dave Currie
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Joined: Mar 4 2001

Lui, unlike you I, as an adult, abhor pornography.

Never-the-less living in a democracy I accept that people have a right to view such images...especially as what's pornography to some may well be common practice to others!

Given that individuals have differing moral standards - I suspect it's difficult to define pornography at the best of times.

However, I suspect - in reality - it's the PARTICIPANTS in EXTREME pornographic pics/videos who are the real exploited and degraded victims!

I doubt anyone can stop kids reading/viewing pornography in this age of mass communications. And we know the Victorians "solved" such issues by pretending they didn't happen...

Surely, parents' time is best spent discussing the moral issues raised by such behaviour...rather than trying to shield kids from reality, by using censorship?

After all who knows what kids get up to behind the school bikeshed? Maybe that's why I have to wear glasses!!

Just another perspective...

Mad_mardy
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Joined: Oct 19 2000

its amazing how many adult people out there are openly admitting to liking pornography

hmmm video and pornography is there a connection :)

as to you lui, i am a parent and i try to encourage my children to be interested in video and computers and general technology.
I do sheild my children from sex at the moment as they are not yet old enough to understand what sex is and i should not have to hide or deface an issue of CV to do this.
this AD should not have appeared in this MAG
and thats all there is to it.

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vega1970
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Joined: Oct 10 2000

In response to the last post, I think you're right, people are becoming less shocked to Porn and less ashamed to admit to viewing and making Porn, in the privacy of your own home..or, indeed, your neighbours..but like everything else you have to know right from wrong. Animals and Children in Porn is Wrong, we all know that, and no-one I know including myself would touch it with a barge pole, but i'm not ashamed to say that I enjoy viewing some porn, so too does my girlfriend, we're not freaks, we both have our own lives, interests and hobbies..we go about our daily routines.. work.. eat..sleep..hope to be parents ourselves some day. England is still dictated to by ageing hypocrites and as time is going by the citizens of this country are realising that this is wrong, people above the age of 18 should be free to select what they can and can't watch, not some faceless dictator...I think i've made my point...I think..

So long Suckas !!!

Unicorn
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Joined: Apr 12 1999

Personally there are a few porn movies I'd like to see solely from a 'film studies' point of view because they've become regarded as classic movies of their time; otherwise I really don't care about it, or what movies other people choose to watch.

quote:Originally posted by Dave Currie:
And we know the Victorians "solved" such issues by pretending they didn't happen...

It's well worth remembering that most of what we 'know' about the Victorians comes from the middle and upper class, who were a tiny fraction of the population. If you read, say, Engels' studies of the working class at the time you get a very, very different picture; when your entire family is living in one room, the kids don't need porn to know what sex is about.

quote:Surely, parents' time is best spent discussing the moral issues raised by such behaviour...rather than trying to shield kids from reality, by using censorship?

I entirely agree; sooner or later you have to let kids lead their own lives, so in the long run this is the best you can do.

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Unicorn
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quote:Originally posted by vega1970:
people above the age of 18 should be free to select what they can and can't watch, not some faceless dictator...

Why 18? I still don't understand this idea that people are old enough to do all this stuff at 16, but shouldn't be able to watch other people do it until they're 18.

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Mad_mardy
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quote:Originally posted by vega1970:
in the privacy of your own home..or, indeed, your neighbours....

hello am i missing something here.

absoloutly nothing wrong with porn,love it infact but in CV? nah i don't think so

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Unicorn
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I'd certainly agree that CV should not put porn in the magazine; but it's very hard for them to police the URLs provided in paid adverts. If nothing else, what would you expect them to do if someone puts in an ad pointing to a perfectly innocent site and then changes the site to point to a porn site after the magazine is printed?

So yes, they certainly should do a quick check on URLs before including an ad, but there's a limit to what you can realistically expect them to protect you from.

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vega1970
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Wow this is getting interesting, I say 18
because it is a safe age...girls of 16 in adult movies may well be frowned upon. I think once you hit 18 you are considered an adult, but oyu are right in what you say about 16, since sex is lega at that age...but thats in this country, in some states in the US thats not the case, so 18 is a safe age to hire actresses for adult movies. What gets me is the attitude of the English...they still believe that Porn is for dirty little men in raincoats, that simply is not the case. Only Saturday past when I was in Oxford st with a friend of mine, we were looking at the DVD section in HMV and there was this very actractive blonde girl perusing the Adult DVD section...I watched her..she looked thgrough them for a good five minutes before checking the next section, I remember thinking 'I hope the staff see this so that it breaks the stereotype of who buys porn'. I think she walked away with the New Order DVD release...not that I was paying that much attention to her...ahem...
(posted by D, who is now soaked, wishing he's put on his raincoat this morning)

So long Suckas !!!

RVS
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Joined: Nov 4 2000

Lui, yes i am a parent and i live in a real world. As such i realise there are things in the world we dont all agee on,and while i do not condone pornography, i do not think it would be wise to try an hide every thing that we think is wrong.It could do more harm than good.
Dont forget tell a kid not to do something an what will he or she do, exactly the opposite.
Back to the point though, the opening page of the offending ( or not offending, depending on which side of the fence you are sitting )site clearly tells you what is to come if advance further.WHICH YOU CLEARLY DID.

pcwells
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Joined: Jun 10 1999

I had a word with the ads team about this one, and was told that the Cathy Barry ad went into classifieds when an advertiser bailed out at the last moment.

I've also been assured that the ad won't be repeated.

I agree that it was an inappropriate ad for CV, but the editorial team have very little say on these matters - our relationship with the advertising department is to give feedback on what's hot and what's not (and Cathy Barry did not feature in my hotlist for May). Neither Bob nor myself were aware of the ad until the copies came in.

But on the plus side, it has sparked off an excellent debate on censorship.

And I'm sure Ms Barry will be very pleased to have so many people talking about her.

Cheers,

Pete

[This message has been inspected for double entendres by pcwells (censored 08 May 2001).]

Unicorn
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quote:Originally posted by vega1970:
but thats in this country, in some states in the US thats not the case, so 18 is a safe age to hire actresses for adult movies.

Well, I wasn't talking about the age of the people *in* the movies, but the age at which they're supposed to be old enough to watch them; at 16 you're considered old enough to do any of these things (and many other things which would be illegal to sell on video in the UK), but you're not old enough to watch other people do them. That makes no sense to me.

I believe the American argument about age of actresses is that they're not considered able to enter into a legal contract until they're 18 and hence can't be hired. That makes sense to me, whereas the fact that people can legally have sex at 16 but can't watch a tape of other people doing it (or, for that matter, can join the army and be sent off to kill people at an age when they can't legally watch a violent movie in the cinema) makes no sense; indeed, I believe the age of consent in some American states is 14 or lower, so that makes their blanket 18 limit on porn even less sensible than ours.

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Jim Bird
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Hi Pete,

You can fool some of the people some of the time......

Hi to others including the Pope and Mr T Blair,

This month's copy of Computer Active Mag has produced an article on, how to filter unwanted websites using your browser.

I suspect some of us with children will possibly be interested, if we do not already have the know-how.

There nothing like a good sex scandal to stir the blood is there. Ask any SUN reader.

Oh in case you are wondering, I think the difference between the SUN and the Beano is about ten pence.

Jim Bird.

[This message has been edited by Jim Bird for Pete's sake (edited 09 May 2001).]

[This message has been edited by Jim Bird (edited 09 May 2001).]

pcwells
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Joined: Jun 10 1999

quote:Originally posted by Jim Bird:
Hi,

[This message has been edited by Jim Bird (edited 09 May 2001).]

You can't fool me.

I was laughing at you before you edited the post!

PD
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Joined: Aug 6 1999

I'm suprised that Bob didn't pull his finger out and come clean on all this earlier.

The fact that the Ad team got in there first and now seem to be taking the caning for this indiscretion really is no justification for a rather poor performance by the Editorial team.

Okay so we all know Bob and Pete are always on the job but they should keep their eye on the target no matter how it's moving.

If they need a hand they can always ask, so if they don't get the relief they are looking for whose to blame?

------------------
Paul

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pcwells
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PD,

You obviously don't know how messy things can get when someone pulls out at the last moment!

Rich T
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Joined: Aug 14 2000

I don't believe the Cathy Barry advert should ever have made it into the magazine.

I appreciate that Bob and Pete had no idea until the copies came out, but the Ads dept would have had guidelines as to what is acceptable or not in the magazine. Just looking at the advertisment, you don't need to be a genius to realise that the link would lead to a sex orintated adult web site - didn't any body in the ads dept look at the ad and think "whoa!" - this isn't our normal type of advertising and go and see the powers that be for a decision????

It's also been stated that the Cathy Barry ad won't run again - it *hasn't* been stated that Ad policy will prevent ads of this nature appearing again.

These ads belong in the top shelf mags not CV.

Richard.

PD
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Hiya Pete,

look I can well imagine the scenario but if you're Ad guys had bent over to make it all happen what's the worst when ther e was no entry?

The way I see it if there was no Ad then CV could only be accused of shooting the odd blank; better that than being accused of being a porn merchant right?

Cheers,

------------------
Paul

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Pierluigi
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Joined: Aug 25 2000

quote:Originally posted by Mad_mardy:
its amazing how many adult people out there are openly admitting to liking pornography

hmmm video and pornography is there a connection :)

as to you lui, i am a parent and i try to encourage my children to be interested in video and computers and general technology.
I do sheild my children from sex at the moment as they are not yet old enough to understand what sex is and i should not have to hide or deface an issue of CV to do this.
this AD should not have appeared in this MAG
and thats all there is to it.

Thankyou very much, finally someone who understands what I'm saying.

Regards

Lui

Pierluigi
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Joined: Aug 25 2000

quote:Originally posted by Unicorn:
[B]I'd certainly agree that CV should not put porn in the magazine; but it's very hard for them to police the URLs provided in paid adverts. If nothing else, what would you expect them to do if someone puts in an ad pointing to a perfectly innocent site and then changes the site to point to a porn site after the magazine is printed?[B]

But this was not an ad pointing to an innocent site, it specifically stated that she was a Porn Star in the ad itself. You cannot for a second suggest that CV did not know what they were printing, I Quote "the official web site of the UK's favourite glamour model and porn star Cathy Barry", not even the most naive of people would think that the link did not point to a porn site.

Regards

Lui

Pierluigi
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quote:Originally posted by RVS:
Lui, yes i am a parent and i live in a real world. As such i realise there are things in the world we dont all agee on,and while i do not condone pornography, i do not think it would be wise to try an hide every thing that we think is wrong.It could do more harm than good..

What so I should just say "the hell with it, if he wants to view it let him?

quote:Dont forget tell a kid not to do something an what will he or she do, exactly the opposite.

Well I don't know about your kids, but if I tell my son not to do something and explain why he shouldn't, then he won't, end of story

quote:Back to the point though, the opening page of the offending ( or not offending, depending on which side of the fence you are sitting )site clearly tells you what is to come if advance further.WHICH YOU CLEARLY DID.

And.... I'm 33, not 11 what's your point? if you have one that is.

Regards

Lui

Pierluigi
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quote:Originally posted by pcwells:
I had a word with the ads team about this one, and was told that the Cathy Barry ad went into classifieds when an advertiser bailed out at the last moment.

You mean to tell me that they have these ads on reserve as space fillers should another advertiser bail. That's very interesting.

On a more serious note, I appreciate your reply and thankyou for your assurances, both myself and my son look forward to the next interesting but "Safe" issue of CV.

Regards

Lui

Unicorn
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quote:Originally posted by Pierluigi:
But this was not an ad pointing to an innocent site, it specifically stated that she was a Porn Star in the ad itself. You cannot for a second suggest that CV did not know what they were printing,

Well, I haven't bought the latest issue yet, so I don't know the details of the ad; however, I'll be buying it tomorrow to see what all the fuss is about...

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pcwells
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Joined: Jun 10 1999

Hi Lui,

No, the Cathy Barry ad wasn't a reserve for CV.

As far as I'm aware, it was a regular classified ad for Digital Photo User - which runs occasional glamour features. While I certainly don't regard DPU as pornographic, it does occasionally feature nudity.

In the absence of an ad for CV, one was poached from DPU's clients. As I said before, CV's editorial team had no say over what and why in this instance.

Cheers,

Pete

Rich T
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Joined: Aug 14 2000

Pete - "As far as I'm aware, it was a regular classified ad for Digital Photo User - which runs occasional glamour features. While I certainly don't regard DPU as pornographic, it does occasionally feature nudity."

I'm sorry, but the Cathy Barry site was not glamour or nudity - it was full blown hardcore.

"As I said before, CV's editorial team had no say over what and why in this instance."

Are adverts lingking to harcore sites going to feature again. I have yet to see any kind of statement saying otherwise and judging by your comment above - you're not sure either?

Richard.

pcwells
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Joined: Jun 10 1999

Hi Richard,

The response I got from the ads people have me confident that there won't be any such ads in future.

But, as I'm not in control of the advertising in the mag, I'm really not the right person to give assurances.

If you would like confirmation on our advertising policy, the person to contact is Arran Lindsay, who can be reached at aaran.lindsay@wvip.co.uk. As Arran isn't a video maker himself, he's seldom on the board to field and answer questions. However, I'm sure he'll welcome your input.

Cheers,

Pete

[This message has been edited by pcwells (edited 10 May 2001).]

Rich T
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Joined: Aug 14 2000

Hi Peter, thx for your reply, I will take your Ad people's word it won't happen again(although I'm still amazed it happened in the first place).

Even so, after reading all the messages on this thread, I haven't detected a single sign of remorse, but rather ducking and diving from CV staffers.

To balance up, I have bought the magzine for the last two years and will continue to do so, as I think it's the best around.

Regards - Richard.

pcwells
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Joined: Jun 10 1999

Hi Richard,

I have to say that I'm really not remorseful in the slightest. Rather, I'm bemused by the decision to run the ad in the first place, and quite frustrated that the blame for all offence caused seems to have landed squarely on my shoulders.

Thank you.

As for "ducking and diving", I don't know how I could have been more honest. I couldn't give an immediate answer until I had answers to give, and I am now trying to address questions as they appear.

Considering the tone of the comments directed at myself and Bob, I'm beginning to realise that my attempts to calm the waters are just making things worse.

Cheers,

Pete

SIFI
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Joined: Sep 16 2001

Isn't the world wide web a wonderful thing. This type of problem was always going to rear its ugly little head.

The combination of videography, the web and pornography is pretty volatile and I'm amazed it has taken this long for these type of ads to appear.

Web addresses for hardcore sites can be found in nearly all newspapers and young persons magazines, not to mention how damned easy they are to find on the web.

Lui, if your child wants to find these sites he will and that will be regardless of whether he sees an ad in CV mag. He will see lots of opportunities in many other places. I remember seeing porn in the school playground that was way more explicit than you will ever get in CV.

The bottom line in my opinion is that we have a duty as parents to educate our children as well as we possibly can in the lessons of life. They will make some of their own decisions and we have to accept that. That isn't to say just let them do it, we just have to do our best.

The biggest problem as a parent today is that the web cannot be effectively policed and our children will see what they want to.

Do the best you can by your children and hopefully they will become well rounded individuals, however CV mag is not going to affect the outcome with one ad. The school playground is far more likely to be an influencing factor.

Regards

SIFI

Simon

Rich T
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Joined: Aug 14 2000

Hi Peter - thanks for showing us the opposite point of view tonight - bemusement.

You are also one of the the public face of CV, you are also Deputy ed, so it's quite natuaral that you will get flak for something not of your doing - part of managemnt, part of the job.

Sifi - I'm a huge believer in the Internet being uncensored. If peole want to go to a website where people are having sex with a lamp post, let it be. How I view it, is that if you don't want to see that side it's quite easy to avoid.

I'm usually the first to argue, when the press sensationalist's say that the Internet is just porn sites, I argue that it's easy to find, but with common sense easy to avoid.

You talk about National newspapers carrying porn site links, well yes some do - but common sense will normally dictate you will find sex links in the Sunday Sport, but not in the Sunday Times. So, by and large you can easily avoid theis sites by a bit of comm0n sense.

I would also like to think that the editorial content at CV is higher than the school yard. In the past I have always viewed CV a being a publication which isn't going to be blighted by these ads.

And if you go back and read Lui's first post, the way I read it, he isn't taking issue with Internet porn, he is taking issue of it appearing in CV. And it's the same with me.

Regards - Richard.

SIFI
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Joined: Sep 16 2001

Richard,

I take your point about Luis origial statement, however the point I was trying to make is that as a parent trying to look out for my children I would be far more concerned with other areas than one ad in CV.

Lui wants to do the best by his child as do all of us parents but I don't honestly believe this advert will change the course of any childs life.

One area I cannot agree with you is the complete non censorship of the web.

Whilst I have no real issues with pornography between two (or more) consenting adults, I have real concerns about the exploitation of people, in particular children. It is far too easy for paedophile sites to exist and this means they can communicate far more easily than they ever could previously.

The only conceivable upshot of this is that it will become even easier for those depraved bastards to get their kicks. Unfortunately this has to be at the expense of a childs innocence.

In most other areas I agree that a forum for the masses to communicate freely is fantastic, but some degree of control of extreme sites wouldn't be a bad thing.

SIFI

Simon

pcwells
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Joined: Jun 10 1999

Hi Richard.

Thanks! This is the first time I've laughed out loud tonight!

I don't know how you've mistaken the role of 'Deputy Editor' for 'managemnt', but let's just say that the swift and sudden promotion has made me quite dizzy!

Pete

Rich T
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Joined: Aug 14 2000

Mmmmmm....I suggest sitting down and having a glass of water

Anyway, made my point - off to bed.

tim@work
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Joined: Apr 30 2001

I have spoken to my solicitor and CV will be receiving a court summons within the next couple of days regarding the 'scandalous' advert placed in May CV. The police have also been informed and the OPA department and you will be formally charged with negligent corruption of children, amongst other charges.

My advice to Peter, is that you flee the country now in order to avoid a long prison term, as it is clearly all your fault.

Also, for any of you interested I am arranging a meet in Bristol on 12th May where we will be trying Cathy Barry as a witch. We're going to have a full video crew there recording the event, and light refreshments will be provided. For more details email tim@getalife.co.uk

I am deeply concerened with CV, and I recommend anyone owning a copy rush out into the streets and burn all of your copies. It's the devil!!

OK, a bit over the top!

The main issue is 'should CV placed that advert'
The answer 'No!'
The reason 'Sales may go down a little due to readers being offended, casting a degraded or cheap view of the mag'

Whats to say that a certain market of CV readers are not in the glamour/adult entertainment industry, maybe the advert is more appropriate than you think. Practical Photography is an even more respected publication than our very own CV, but adverts of this nature are found all the time. Prac Photo is essentially for adults as the articles and issues inside it are mature and technical, ie of no interest to kids.

CV is the same! What are kids doing reading it anyway? and, if they are, then adults who buy it should be aware that the photo and video industry also has an adult perspective and that adverts of this nature may then appear in these publications.

CV and Prac Photo are trying to appeal to all readers, but I think least on there list is kids, well maybe younger adults, like at college and uni, but not young kids. And, even if a kid was interested, lets say photography, you would scour Prac Photo for inappropriate content and remove it or explain it in an adult way, to develop mature opinions in young minds. If these kind of ads appeared in games magazines and other youth orientated mags, I would certainly raise an eyebrow. But, adult entertainment does belong in the realms of digital video, because that is one of it's many mediums. I don't expect magazines to be swamped in it, but flicking through the advert section I never once thought 'oh my god, what's that doing in there' because it should. She's trying to raise business for her video work, in a video magazine, what's so wrong or difficult to undestand about that. Budding pornographers who read CV may see that and go 'yeh, I think I'll hire her'. Job done, the advert served a purpose everybody made a bit of money.

CV, the jury has found you 'not guilty' and you are aquitted of all charges, I just hope that your sales do not dip because you may have hinted that your audience maybe a little broader than some thought.

Muchus respec and luv to the CV team, keep it up. If the Advertising department do get a caning, make sure you get some footage, you might make a mint in some foriegn markets????

Tim

emmelleff
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Joined: Mar 20 2001

I'll bet Cathy Barry has never found it so easy to get so many men so hot under the collar. Then again...........

Am I alone in thinking she's bit of an hound?

Regards

MLF

tim@work
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Joined: Apr 30 2001

She ain't my cup of earl grey,

but I'm sure she is a lot of fellas cuppa tetley.

And remember, all women are beautiful, it's some of us men who make them ugly (or hounds, as you put it)

Tim

vega1970
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Joined: Oct 10 2000

I think she's quite cute actually,
to the point where i've re-written a scene in my current project..Ahem!...mind you I do go for that dark Goth look...i'll probably call her today....see if she's suitable for the scene....or rather if the Scene is suitable for her...I bet she's all talk..lets find out..the HARD way...

So long Suckas !!!

red
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Joined: Oct 1 2000

I hope Mr Crabtree is banging heads together behind the scenes. I know I would be. The decision to run that ad should have involved everybody. It doesn't belong in C.V.

A definite lowering of standards, bowing to the almighty profit margin.

If you want porn buy a porn mag. We musn't let it infiltrate every aspect of our lives. Already rife on t.v. and internet, adults know where to go if they want it.

It's a sad day when parents have to hide their monthly read from the kid's.

Unicorn
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Joined: Apr 12 1999

quote:Originally posted by tim@work:
Whats to say that a certain market of CV readers are not in the glamour/adult entertainment industry, maybe the advert is more appropriate than you think.

I'm currently editing an hour-long drama set in a lap-dancing club which includes more than a little nudity, but I'd still say that if anyone wants people to act in such movies (or outright porn) then CV isn't the place to be looking.

Certainly I don't see any reason why kids shouldn't be reading the magazine; I first worked on a low-budget movie when I was eleven or twelve, and had the technology existed at the time I'd have been very interested in it.

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tim@work
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Joined: Apr 30 2001

quote:Originally posted by red:
I hope Mr Crabtree is banging heads together behind the scenes. I know I would be. The decision to run that ad should have involved everybody. It doesn't belong in C.V.


It does belong in CV because I presume people from the adult industry are readers of CV the same with Practical Photographer. The site wasn't there to get people to gawp over her and join her site, It was more aimed toward the budding pornographer that uses DV as a medium, who would like to hire performers.

quote:A definite lowering of standards, bowing to the almighty profit margin.

I would presume that anyone who placed an ad in CV would have to pay the same, therefore profit margins being consistent. Also, remeber what pays for a lot of the mag that we read....advertising. If I was a sales person and I had something to fill that gap, I think I would. Not for renumerative benefit, but beacause that's my job, and if I don't do it, I get replaced. Standards have not been lowered, the publication is still class 'A'. Would you consider a mag like Practical Photography low standard? It has been the head of it's field for years and years, and it advertises models and glamour girls in the back, cos guess what there are people with cameras that do that....and guess what, the same applies to Digital Video.....errmmm...Wake Up!!

quote:If you want porn buy a porn mag. We musn't let it infiltrate every aspect of our lives. Already rife on t.v. and internet, adults know where to go if they want it.

OK, now i'm getting a little angry.
The ad wasn't intended for left handed browsing, Get It?? You're quote about porn infiltration does indicate a certain narrow mindedness. Again, I say, what about all the violence that is screened and depicted on TV. You say, adults know where to go if they want porn. Do kids know where to go if they don't want to see violence? or do they know that they shouldn't want to imitate characters jumping around fighting and hacking at each other with swords. Although no studies have been done and hopefully never will because kids are not guinae pigs, I could imagine a society less concerned with conflict if sex was portrayed a little less deviant and violence played down some.

quote:It's a sad day when parents have to hide their monthly read from the kid's.

It's a sad day when a parent hides anything from their kids. CV is not harbouring anything illegal or immoral. How likely is it that a child will see that image and URL and go corr look a the rack on that and go and have a look. I don't think kids think like that, and would simply not bother. And, if they are at an age where they do, they are going to find it, so it's best explained at an earlier age rather than have to come to their own immature misconceptions. Teach them, You will do more harm by hiding anything, because there is only acertain amount you can hide. It's your job to know when the time is right.

Sorry if I've offended you, but you offended me with your talk of infiltration....Touchez (sorry, no acute accent)

Tim

[This message has been edited by tim@work (edited 10 May 2001).]

tim@work
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Joined: Apr 30 2001

Me Thinx this topic is

PANDORA'S BOX

not Cathy Barry's

Unicorn
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Joined: Apr 12 1999

quote:Originally posted by tim@work:
How likely is it that a child will see that image and URL and go corr look a the rack on that and go and have a look. I don't think kids think like that, and would simply not bother.

I still haven't seen the ad in question because the local shop has sold out, but I think I can safely say that had I been given the opportunity as a kid, I would have done precisely that. I often wonder whether most people forget what they were like as kids when they grow up, or whether we just don't want to admit that most of us were such little brats... I'm still amazed that my parents managed to raise a large family without going loopy.

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vega1970
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Joined: Oct 10 2000

I gotta say I do agree with Tim,
the ad does belong in the mag, she's an Actress advertising her services to FilmMakers such yourself....and CV is a FilmMakers mag.......it makes perfect sense to me. The picture in the ad was not offensive, she is more dressed than pics you might find in the tabloids, na dht esite does warn you of the content...

So long Suckas !!!

tim@work
Offline
Joined: Apr 30 2001

Hi Unicorn,

You may have been an inspirational youngster, but when I was 11, I was still shouting 'ratta tada ratta' with cobra commander and optimus prime (optimus prime won of course!!). I'd seen pictures of naked people but mostly giggled at the pics. At about 13 when I was a bit more aware of what sex was about, I had my first encounter with porn. You know, the playing card type with all sorts of bits stuffed in bits and everywhere. At first I couldn't even tell what was going on, but when I did, I thought it was one of the funniest things I'd seen in my life. Yes, kids are intrigued and I suppose at a certain period of development they will go looking. That same year I got caught with a porn mag in my bedroom that I'd got from a mate. I was expecting the thrashing of my life, but instead I got a lecture. I was told that I was too young to understand why adults do some of the things that were there, and they were right I didn't get it, I thought they were funny, but a bit intriguing? None the less, the magazine wasn't confiscated, I soon got bored and went back to football.

I'd learned that adults do funny things and thought it was stupid and humorous. No harm was done. If I had been told off and reprimanded, the magazine confiscated and told to never look at anything like that again, what opinion of the funny things adults do would I have. I would think that it was wrong, horrible even and maybe even more intrigued because I was a rat bag, and anything naughty would have been a challenge.

So as a child now, if I saw the Cathy Barry advert now would I go hunting. I think if I knew it was naughty to do so, probably. If I was in the period of my sexual realisation, I probably would have already seen a million things like it already. And if I was just a normal playful kid, I think I wouldn't have even batted an eyelash cos girls were the last thing on my mind at that age, back to cobra commander.

Cheers

Tim

PD
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Joined: Aug 6 1999

This has really spread wide.

I guess Bob must still have his head down...

------------------
Paul

Paul Dutton
DVdoctor R&D

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vega1970
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Joined: Oct 10 2000

Speaking of people having
their head down..Iwonder what Miss ...naw...I won't even go there, but than again, given half the chance...

So long Suckas !!!

red
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Joined: Oct 1 2000

Sex sells and the ad man has obviously slipped one in ('scuse me) to test reaction. All this open mindedness and liberalism misses the point. It's definitely a way of gearing up revenue, pulling in the profits.

It's also a change in policy for C.V. This magazine doesn't need to do this type of ad, it doesn't belong there.

It's too good to be spoilt by tackiness.

Peter Golden
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Joined: Mar 21 2001

Lui,
I have kids of comparable ages, but worse a daughter of 12 (and worse still, beautiful), and a son of 8. Being a professionally trained bullsh***er, sorry, Philosepher. (Oh alright, I got a degree in it from The University of Easy Access), I have spent some time thinking about this. My conclusion is that you are absolutely right to be concerned about this, and, simultaeneously, there is nothing now that you can do about it.
If you (and all other caring parents), have done the best you can with the groundwork, i.e. instilling values of fairness and decency at the earliest possible age, then:
Yes, your kids may look at it; may be tittilated by it; but will not be harmed by it. It is the scourge of our Island that we have a repressed view of sexuality.

Personally, I agree with an earlier poster:
Sex is a natural necessity for the survival of our species, Violence, is not.....

Having said that, I hate the Welsh, dont you?

Dave Currie
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Joined: Mar 4 2001

Pete,

You are the weakest link...GOODBYE!

red
Offline
Joined: Oct 1 2000

Another way of looking at it;

Intel Play Microscope (kid's toy) on the front cover one month.

Cathy Barry in the ad's next month.

Contradiction of terms?

Pierluigi's spot on.

[This message has been edited by red (edited 13 May 2001).]

[This message has been edited by red (edited 13 May 2001).]

Dave Currie
Offline
Joined: Mar 4 2001

One month a kid's toy... next month an adult's toy. SO there IS a COMMON link!

**********
But wait - there's worse to come! When I looked through MY microscope at bacteria on a slide, they were all unashamedly reproducing - and at an alarming rate - right before my very eyes!

Knowing the sensitivity of some CV readers I shouted to my wife: "Quick get the screens - innocent CV readers must be protected from the sex lives of lowly unicellular microorganisms such as these cathy bactoleria!"

Chapter 2 - The Awakening

Then I awoke.It had all been a horrible dream!

Gone was the image of the evil Dr Bob and his hideous assistant Pete who, in my dream, had been using the microscope to help speed-up the breeding process of plastic-eating bacteria... which were to be used to destroy competitors' CD cover discs - turning them into vile-coloured plastic blow-up dolls.

Their plan was to ensure each publication's Advertising Manager was sentenced to at least six months in prison - listening to old Gary Glitter songs...by which time the mags would all have gone bust...and the evil Dr Bob would have gained total control of ALL video and computer magazines!

All I can say is thank God it was only a dream - or was it? Only time will tell...

***********

There's a moral here somewhere...but I think it's got an 'im' in front of it!

Time to chill out!
Dave C

[This message has been edited by Dave Currie (edited 13 May 2001).]

tim.callaghan
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Joined: Apr 4 2001

Dude,

You gotta get out more!!!

Tim

(PS- I can talk!)

Darren Pollard
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Joined: Oct 4 2000

I tend to agree with you all, no porn in CV magazine.

How about a pop-up on this site instead?

emmelleff
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Joined: Mar 20 2001

Can we not put Cathy Barry to bed once and for all?

Do you not feel it's been flogged enough?

Ooh er, missus!

Regards

MLF

pcwells
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Joined: Jun 10 1999

Well, the topic would probably drop quite quickly if people didn't keep replying to it.

Stop putting Cathy Barry on top!

Pete

pcwells
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Joined: Jun 10 1999

And by that, I mean stop adding to this thread.

Cheers,

Pete

vega1970
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Joined: Oct 10 2000

Aaaahhhhh...Poor Cathy,
it does'nt sound as though she'll be getting space in the mag next month so i'll help her get as much coverage as possible...despite the fact I want to uncover her BIG time..

Vega
(President of the Cathy Barry Fan Club)

So long Suckas !!!

Pierluigi
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Joined: Aug 25 2000

Ok, I started this thread, and I have made my point as so has everyone else, so I would ask the almighty administrators to please close this thread and put it to rest and lets all get back to the topic of video editing on computers.

Kind Regards

Lui

PD
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Joined: Aug 6 1999

Just so everyone is clear on this, it wasn’t me who originally got the padlock out and bound up Ms. Barry…

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