Is the ME 66 the best choice?

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gordon richards
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Joined: Nov 16 2002

Recently did a wedding where the speeches were all on one long table. I put my Sech K6 plus Shotgun in the middle of the table and for the Groom and Brides Dad the sound was great. But the sound from the Best Man at the end of the table was very poor.
Should I use another capsule from Schn range to overcome this problem? I really don't fancy going over to radio mikes.

Cheers.

g. richards

John Willett at Home
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Joined: Jun 29 2001

It depends on positioning.

But you may find the ME 64 cardioid capsule on the K 6 better for the speeches.

John

harlequin
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i'm not great with sound but for that type of scenario ( in my case board meetings) have you tried boundary mics.

we use http://www.audio-technica.com/prodpro/profiles/AT849.html with our video conferencing equipment which picks up everything in the room.

this is where the sound guys come and tell me it won't work !!!!!

Gary MacKenzie

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gordon richards
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Thanks Gary,

I have heard of boundary mikes, but understand that if someone bangs say a glass down on the table the noise is very very noticeable. Don't know if this is true, your veiws would be appreciated.

Cheers

Gordon

g. richards

harlequin
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it can be true , depends upon how the mic is set up.

you can set it up on a surface facing the people and it uses that surface as the 'microphone plate'

it is trial and error , but we use the whole ceiling structure in one room to be the mic.

Gary MacKenzie

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gordon richards
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Hi Gary

A few days later and still thick head on I'm afraid.

Could you please explain what you mean by the whole ceiling structure ????

Sorry to be a pain.

Cheers.

g. richards

harlequin
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if you look at http://www.audio-technica.com/prodpro/profiles/AT851a.html you will see that they have a 240 degree pickup area , and we find that mounting them on a solid background improves the pickup considerably , therefore acting like a larger microphone.
it's as if the whole surface it is mounted on is acting like a pickup plate.

john willet can explain from the 'technical side' , me i stick to 'it works for me side' and thats how i see it working.
if you mount them on a soft surface you notice the change in sound picked up.

because ours are on the ceiling , facing down and away from the equipment , we therefore cover all of the room in front of the mic.

Gary MacKenzie

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gordon richards
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Sounds a good idea. Last Question , I PROMISE.

How do you attach them to the ceiling?

Recently I did a Wedding Recption where the ceiling was possibly 20ft high and without a long ladder there is no way you could get up there.

By the way how much do these mics cost.

Thanks once again

Gordon.

g. richards

harlequin
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mics aren't cheap .... we buy them in lots of 20 , due to number of systems spread across the 'virtual campus'

we put screws into the ceiling ( permanently )
i would suggest that you could just attach them ( i.e. sit them ) on a table just in front of the main table or even on the main table at the wedding.
with mic facing main table , the audience participation should not be picked up as loudly as the top tables.

best idea is to try one out if you can , it may not do what you want it to , whereas they do exactly what we want them to do , which is to pick up all the people in the meeting and send that to the microphone input on the video-conferencing decks.

Gary MacKenzie

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John Willett
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Well, my boundary mics cost £1,442.00 + VAT each - you can get cheaper ones, though ;)

You do get an increase in pressure at a boundary and a boundary microphone takes advantage of this.

They are good, but have to be on a large surface or you lose bass response.

John

John
 
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harlequin
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so my non-technical answer was pretty close then !

Gary MacKenzie

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northernimage
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We use one radio mic to record speeches,
a SH EW500 with tie clip. It's placed on the top table in front of the speaker, it works well and also picks up little comments from the surrounding guests as well as applause etc from the room.
Usually there is a MC who will move the mic in front of the next speaker as he introduces them.
Camera 2 uses it's onboard mic as backup.
As you say, it works for me.

garybarr
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pfj,

I'm thinking of doing it this way..how do you mount the mic?

northernimage
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I simply leave the tie clip wire wrapped around the transmitter and clip it to itself if you get my meaning, put some foam or tape around the lead though to stop the tie clip biting into the wire.
I've had top table guests banging on the table when applauding but it doesn't seem to bother it.
It works really well providing the speaker doesn't start wandering from his position too much. Simple is often best, hope this helps.

garybarr
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Joined: Oct 5 2004

thanks, I've read bits about clipping the mic to flowers etc. so others seem to like this method.

is it easy to put any mic through a transmitter with the appropriate cable? I want to use an ME66 through the tx.

northernimage
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Not sure about compatability of different mics there are other people on here who have much more experience of this than me.
As far as clipping mics to flowers etc, that's fine but it makes it much more difficult to reposition for different speakers.
It's much quicker and just as effective to leave it on the table in front of the speaker, it can't be seen on camera and the last thing the couple want is someone sticking their mits into their very expensive top table decorations.

tom hardwick
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I think you've read that the radio mic is disguised by the flowers, not clipped to them. Top table flower arrangements start at £50, so don't go bulldog clipping them just yet, especially if she's looking.

tom.

garybarr
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Joined: Oct 5 2004

will you still pick up good sound from that distance? suppose it could be up to about 3 metres away ot the subject.

garybarr
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thinking of using 2 x ME66's wirelessly on stands on the table, one in front of bride(for groom, father of the bride and bride if she speaks) and one at the other end for the best man/men - finding more and more couples having 2 or even 3 best men and you can't radio mic the whole table! what do you think of the setup?

John Willett
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Quote:
Originally posted by gigs:
...what do you think of the setup?

Good, but you may find it better to use the ME 64 cardioid head instead of the ME 66.

You may find the ME 66 is a bit too directional in that situation.

John

John
 
A picture tells a thousand words, but sound tells a thousand pictures.

garybarr
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thanks John. I think I might use one of each(me66 + 64), with the 64 for the larger group who may speak and then I'll also be able to use the 66 as an on camera replacement for the camera mic.

hedleyw
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Quote:
Originally posted by gigs:
thanks John. I think I might use one of each(me66 + 64), with the 64 for the larger group who may speak and then I'll also be able to use the 66 as an on camera replacement for the camera mic.

That's the arrangement I use, moving the mic when necessary. One thing I have noticed is that the me64 has a much brighter sound than the me66 which is decidedly "flat" by comparison (any comments John?). Best to stick to one or the other for the speakers. I sometimes mix in some effect for the audience from the me66 on the camera but usually the me64 on the table is just fine.

Hedley Wright Web design: brettvalestudios.co.uk/webdesign.html Follow me on Twitter twitter.com/bvstudios

garybarr
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Joined: Oct 5 2004

I haven't tried it yet but have a wedding coming up in a couple of weeks, so I'm glad I seem to be on the right lines!
I think I'll use the 66 though for the best man as he sits right at the other end of the table - what do you think? and then 64 for groom/fotb and pointing at the bride in the middle so I get her as she will also be speaking. these will be both radio mics using the E112 G2 kit - tried it out at home and seems to work very well.
I'm not very clued up about audio yet, so what's the score with mic attenuator on camera? should I use it? and the roll off switch on the Senns? when should I use these?
thanks for any help.

hedleyw
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You should be able to cover bride, groom and fob with the me64 as you suggest, but beware of brides with a loud laugh spoiling the groom or fob's speech.

As I have already said, I find the me64 and me66 have quite different tonal characteristics so I stick with the me64 and move it when necessary - if there is a toastmaster he will usually be happy to do this if you ask him "nicely"

The bass roll-off switch on the mic is used to help reduce wind noise, don't use it unless necessary.

You might need some attenuation for the ME66, 10dB is ideal but my PD170 attenuation is 20dB which is often too much. You can buy an in-line attenuator but they are quite bulky. There is also an attenuator setting on the plug-on transmitter which should be set to "on" unless using a dynamic mic.

Hope that helps.

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gordon richards
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Joined: Nov 16 2002

Message for Hedley-Wright
Thanks for your message. IU notice that Keene Electronics sell 10dB Attenuators for about £20.00. They look as if they just plug into the end of the ME66 mike. Is the the type of unit you mean, and are the safe to just plug in. Or would it be better to use the 20dB on the PD150
Thanks.

g. richards

hedleyw
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Quote:
Originally posted by gordon richards:
Message for Hedley-Wright
Thanks for your message. IU notice that Keene Electronics sell 10dB Attenuators for about £20.00. They look as if they just plug into the end of the ME66 mike. Is the the type of unit you mean, and are the safe to just plug in. Or would it be better to use the 20dB on the PD150
Thanks.

Yes, that is the type of unit I was referring to. 10dB is ideal, and they are safe to just plug in. Only problem is that they are quite heavy and the total length of ME66 + K6 + attenuator is rather unwieldy.
The 20dB attentuation on the PD150 is OK if levels are high, but in other situations is really too much IMHO.
I believe you can have a mod done to the K6 capsule (red dot?) to reduce sensitivity by about 10dB. Perhaps John Willett will comment...

Hedley Wright Web design: brettvalestudios.co.uk/webdesign.html Follow me on Twitter twitter.com/bvstudios

gordon richards
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Joined: Nov 16 2002

Thank you very much Hedley.

Regards.

Gordon.

g. richards

gordon richards
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Thank you very much Hedley.

Regards.

Gordon.

g. richards