Sennheiser Radio Receiver Mic Lead to PD 170P Wiring Question, continued

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Paul FWF
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Joined: Feb 5 2009

The issue is; the lead I've acquired, to connect my Sennheiser ew100 Receiver out (mini jack) and XLR Male, (at the other end) to my PD170p Camera, is wired for Mono, according to the bloke in the radio supplies shop who tested the lead for me. He told me that it was wired for Mono, and he reckons it should be wired for stereo because he thinks that the mini jack output (on the Sennheiser ew100 receiver) should be stereo and the XLR Male at the other end should also be stereo to match the XLR female input on channel 1 on the PD170p DVCamera I'm using. He told me I needed a wiring Diagram for the XLR Male, a spec sheet for the ew100 receiver and a spec sheet to verify that the PD170p is a stereo XLR audio In... Help...:confused:

colin rowe
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Radio mics are mono. You have a switch by the XLRs on ths PD170 that you can set to route the sound to channel 1 or channel 1 and 2

Colin Rowe

runner
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Joined: Feb 6 2007

XLRs are mono connectors. It's possible the man in the shop needs to read about about balanced audio connector wiring.

mooblie
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Joined: Apr 27 2001

It's mono. "The bloke in the radio supplies shop" should be sacked.

And: "....stereo to match the XLR female input on channel 1 on the PD170p DVCamera I'm using..." That's mono too, not stereo. Balanced signal, it's true, but mono.

"the PD170p is a stereo XLR audio In" - no, it's two balanced mono inputs - on the two XLRs.

Martin - DVdoctor in moderation. Everyone is entitled to my opinion.

Paul FWF
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Joined: Feb 5 2009
Thanks for the advice

It's a process of elimination this business, isn't it?
So, I know that the XLR input on the camera is working because my microphone works fine and the audio levels (when its switched to channels 1+2) are registering... now that I know that the lead is working and is wired in mono (which is correct) the next step is to test the receiver by plugging it in to channel 1, making sure that I've first swiched the PD-170p to channel 1, (Mono-In) and have switched the phantom power off... and as long as the radio transmitter and receiver are (obviously) tuned to the same frequency and the transmitter is transmitting (I've established that it does transmit already) then, I should get a mono signal level on the camera/s audio monitor, if not, then it can only be that the receiver is a duffer... am on the right track???

Should the mini jack on the Receiver's mini jack to XLR Male have two black bands on the shaft? I looked at the 1/4 jack on a Vocal mic jack lead I have and that only has one black ring on the shaft. Due to the fact that the mini jack has two black bands - could that mean that it's a stereo mini jack - or SHOULD it have two black bands???

mooblie
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Yes, the minijack on the Receiver-to-camera cable correctly has two black insulating bands, hence three connections (knows as "TRS" - tip, ring, sleeve, as it is a balanced mono signal, carried on three conductors: ground, signal+ and signal-) - but it's still mono.

I take it you're not getting any audio registering on the camera?

What input sensitivity (SENSIT) have you set the TRANSMITTER to?
Are you getting good audio level indication (AF) on the TRANSMITTER?
Is PILOT on on the TRANSMITTER?

Are you getting PILOT indication on the RECEIVER?
Are you getting good radio signal strength indication (RF) on the RECEIVER?
Are you getting good audio signal strength indication (AF) on the RECEIVER?
What output level (AF OUT) have you set the RECEIVER to?

What input sensitivity have you set your PD-170 to (mic/line)?

(My money's on a Pilot tone issue.)

Martin - DVdoctor in moderation. Everyone is entitled to my opinion.

John Willett
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Joined: Jun 1 2001

The EK 100 receiver is *unbalanced* mono !

There is no connection on the ring of the mini-jack.

Only the EK 500 is balanced.

The XLR cable that is supplied with the EK 100 can be plugged into a balanced or unbalanced XLR input.

The mini-jack lead has the stereo mini-jack at the far end wired so the signal goes into both left and right channels of a consumer camcorder.

I hope this helps.

mooblie uses the 500 series and forgot that the 100 series is unbalanced on the camera receiver output. ;)

John
 
A picture tells a thousand words, but sound tells a thousand pictures.

mooblie
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Apologies - JW is, of course, correct, I didn't know of this difference between the 100 and 500 series! Mea culpa! I'll get me coat.

Martin - DVdoctor in moderation. Everyone is entitled to my opinion.

sleepytom
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by convention audio cables are wired to be compatible with both stereo and ballenced mono.
the wiring connections are as follows

Jack XLR
Tip------Pin 2 (hot / left)
Ring-----Pin 3 (cold / right)
Sleve----Pin 1 (ground)

this is a clever design as it allows the cable to carry the 3 main signal types (unbalanced stereo, unbalanced mono, and balanced mono)
In the case of unbalanced mono pins 3 and 1 are connected together automatically at the jack end where the ring is connected to ground inside the jack socket. This allows you to connect an unbalanced mono signal into a balanced XLR.

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People interested in live production might like to check out http://atemuser.com 

Paul FWF
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Joined: Feb 5 2009
Befuddled, but thanks for the excellent advice..

I'm beginning to realise how little I know about audio. I think I've got to find me a course dedicated to dealing with sound recording technique covering the basic principles but I've learned a lot from the advice offered via this site. I suppose skillset might be the best place to start looking.

My ew100 (EK100 Receiver and SKP100 Transmitter) radio mic kit is quite old and came with a Audio Technica lavalier mic and power module which houses a female XLR socket, which seems odd because the SKP IOO Transmitter is also powered, so maybe I have mismatched equipment?

I have tried the Transmitter and receiver again but am not getting any signal on the camera's audio channel. The Receiver's RF (green) light is permanently lit, which I think means that it is supposed to be receiving a signal from the transmitter.

I feel well out of my depth and do not know how to tune the set in so I need a course or hands on advice from someone who is familiar with the kit to establish whether the kit is broke or whether something is set incorrectly, AF etc. I need to learn how to run through the check list before I can use this kit properly.

I'm based on Merseyside, does anyone know where I might be able to go to get the issue resolved?

HallmarkProductions
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Joined: Aug 29 1999

try searching on YouTube for Sennheiser - you will find some "how to" videos there.
Worset scenario here is that you borrow/but a Sennheiser mic for your transmitter. New, about £50 ish.

Chris
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John Willett
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Paul FWF wrote:
My ew100 (EK100 Receiver and SKP100 Transmitter) radio mic kit is quite old and came with a Audio Technica lavalier mic and power module which houses a female XLR socket, which seems odd because the SKP IOO Transmitter is also powered, so maybe I have mismatched equipment?

The AT lav. will have a battery to power the microphone - the SKP 100 has a battery to power the transmitter.

The SKP 100 can *not* power the microphone.

John
 
A picture tells a thousand words, but sound tells a thousand pictures.