Wedding Sample 2

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Flame1
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Joined: Apr 21 2007

Hi, just another extract.

Any comments appreciated.

Thank you.

Flame.

colin rowe
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Nice one John. Inventive and realy well shot and edited (as usual) and would delight any couple. Quick change of tack. Have you decided on your camera choice yet? I am in the same situation, its camera change year. I experienced the joys of playing with an EX1 for a day, thanks to Paul Kellett. Now that is some camera, amazing picture quality. But I think it is maybe overkill for wedding work. I think, having played with the EX1 it was a case of wanting one, rather than needing one. I am now looking at the Canon XH A1. Like you, I like the warmer look that the Canon gives compared to the Sony FX1, and the control and customisation of this camera is amazing. I am going to check one out, hopefully, next week. It is supposed to be better in low light than the FX1. I plan to shoot some side by side comparison shots before making my final decision. What do you encode you demo clips with/at? They go to full screen display very well.

Colin Rowe

tom hardwick
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Very nice Flame! I really liked the shot towards the end where the bride was leaning against the wall and you tracked around her, and the clasping hands in the next shot. Nice softness to the whole thing, cut accurately to the points.

The opening pull back was slightly less than smooth though, and I didn't like the auto exposure getting the upper hand as you pass behind the tree, but these are niggles really in a fine piece of romanticism.

Colin - I too tend to think the EX1 is more than most weddings deserve, though its low-light performance is remarkable. I'm disturbed by its rolling shutter effects that make electronic flashes look so odd, and of course on wedding days this happens a great deal. I've posted elsewhere about this.

The A1 wins over the FX1 in that you can plug in XLRs without added Beachtek boxes and its long zoom is useful for picking off guests and wildlife from afar. I wouldn't rate a 'warmer look' as a buying decision as that so easily fixed in post. If you like the FX1 then you should buy a Z1 (or a Z7 maybe, but again the CMOS chips worry me).

tom.

branny
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Joined: Nov 6 2001

Nice stuff John. Great scenes, but for me, too much of a muchness.
Probably my fault as I watched with no sound. Something I do with my own highlights as it concentrates the mind on the film. Also . . . film glitch again about 2-30.

I beat myself up many times a day watching our shots from weddings and it always seems to be the 'shot of the day' that has a niggling flaw - tog stepping in/guest trolling by at the wrong moment or a teeny glitch which mars these most exceptional shots.
Don't take these trivial points personally ( I know you won't anyway) as they're only very minor observations that help keep all our edits razor sharp.
I for one torment myself in all our edits seeking the 'to die for' moments and slotting these into the continuity of the day.
Sometimes I wonder why I didn't take up the mouth organ. Much easier to carry around, yet still creative. Then again . . . I'd miss the adrenalin :)

Do not follow, I may not lead. Do not lead . . . I may not follow.

Lusky
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branny wrote:
I watched with no sound. Something I do with my own highlights as it concentrates the mind on the film.

I beat myself up many times a day watching our shots from weddings and it always seems to be the 'shot of the day' that has a niggling flaw - tog stepping in/guest trolling by at the wrong moment or a teeny glitch which mars these most exceptional shots.

That's a good idea Branny, too often I get more caught up making sure the music a pictures are working well.

How many times though do you get excited by a shot when you're filming it only to be disappointed when you see it.

Flame,
nice and elegant with some lovely movement. If I was being nitpicky and I do mean nitpicky then it would be that there was too many walking shots maybe make one a bit different by overlying another shot from the photoshoot at about 50%, something like head shots. But I'm nitpicking
Anyway overall It was great and fitted the pace of the song well.

John Paul

perproductions
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I love your work, you do hand held so well!! you make it look amazing.
what camera are you using? also what do you use to edit and what filters/effects do you have on the video.??

Cheers

Flame1
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Joined: Apr 21 2007

Thank you for all your comments, all appreciated, with some very kind ones.:o

Tom, I tend to toggle between auto and manual exposure throughout the day, but yes it does get me sometimes. So much to think about. I actually struggled to keep up with them running, hence then being also too near the right side of the screen as I came out from the tree....time for a workout:)

All your comments are much appreciated, and taken on board.:)

Colin....We are picking up twp Canon Xh-A1's on thurday, and hoping to use them at this weekends wedding at pembroke lodge, Richmond park to see how they are, although this depends on how quick we can get used to the manual controls on the camera, without constantly needing to look down at the controls!

The encoding settings we used are directly from premiere CS3, VBR...WMV...de-interlaced.

Branny, your comments will always be appreciated, spot on all the time:)

Hi Perproductions, thank you for your extremely generous comments. We used the FX1 but I am struggling to like this camera for many reasons.....

We do use some effects from CS3,Gamma, etc, although I know this is not always to everyones liking, and I do agree it can detract, rather than enhance the footage.

Kind regards,

Flame.

perproductions
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i like the effects you use, its something i have never played with, i should really start experimenting to see what there is.

once again, brilliant work, im 21 and just starting out but would love to be doing work of that standard one day!!

David L Lewis
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Joined: Jan 11 2006

Love your work and find it very inspirational.

Quote:
The encoding settings we used are directly from premiere CS3, VBR...WMV...de-interlaced.

Im still getting to grips with trying to find the best settings for encoding using CS3

I'm asuming you start by exporting as adobe media encoder?

This opens up the expot settings and am i right in thinking you choose windows media as your format and Pal widescreen source to download 1024bps as a preset?

and finaly what do you set the average bit rate at. Obviously the higher the bigger the file and therefore the longer its going to take to download. at the moment I leave it at the default 872 but for a 5 minute clip this is producing a 30Mb file which seems very big.

just be interested in what you use?

David L Lewis

Hello I'm in Mensa, Is there anything you would like me to explain to you?

colin rowe
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John.
Post from Cyberwest. Side by side comparison between FX1 and XH-A1 here http://forums.dvdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=45045. I Think I am going to go with the XA-H1, checking one out later in the week.

Colin Rowe

pkbristol
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colin rowe wrote:
. I experienced the joys of playing with an EX1 for a day, thanks to Paul Kellett. Now that is some camera, amazing picture quality. .

AKA pkbristol
Hi Colin. Hope all is well.

Paul.

colin rowe
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Hi Paul
You really messed my head up, letting me play with your EX1. It is an amazing bit of kit. But head must rule heart, and wallet. So I am probably going to sell the FX1 and buy Canon XH-A1s. Speak to you soon.

Colin Rowe

tom hardwick
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I'd gently suggest that selling the FX1 and buying a Canon XH-A1 won't make a scrap of difference to your films Colin, and that's because it's a simple sideways move. Both cameras are aimed at precisely the same customer, though Canon have tried to grab those undecided between the FX1 and Z1.

It surprises a lot of people to see how little different in real terms a 20x is over a 12x zoom. The cameras are neck and neck in the gloom (though the Canon's full tele is pretty slow). It's top screen is not as good as the FX1s in my view.

I always recommend that people 'leap-frog' when they buy their next camera because it's best to grow into a camera than grow out of it. The depreciation hit you'll take selling the FX1 means you should aim higher than the Canon, and the EX1 should keep calling you.

There - your head's messed up again, and you thought you'd got it all sorted.

tom.

Rob James
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Joined: Jun 26 2001

Colin, I have to add my voice to Tom's. After seeing the footage you sent me I wouldn't even consider going for anything less than an EX-1 (despite the rolling shutter issue) if I already had an FX-1. To my eye the EX-1 output is in a different league to any HDV cam I've seen so far. Even in my current position, I.e. first foray into HD, I cannot bring myself to spend the money I can afford to get into HDV now I've seen what the EX-1 is capable of.

If I were you, I'd wait until I could afford an EX-1 (or whatever comes out in the meantime that is as good or better).

Rob The picture is only there to keep the sound in sync

Tony7
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Joined: Mar 21 2001
Flame1 wrote:
Hi, just another extract.

Any comments appreciated.

Thank you.

Flame.

John, links missing.

Tony.
Asrock Z68 Extreme7 --i7-2700K --Edius Pro7--HDStorm+ --16GB Kingston HyperX--GTX 560Ti--AX850 PSU--MxM PCI-e Reader--Win8.1 Pro 64bit

Arthur.S
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tom hardwick wrote:
I wouldn't rate a 'warmer look' as a buying decision as that so easily fixed in post.

Just a thought, but couldn't this be fixed with custom preset?

Flame1
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Joined: Apr 21 2007

Talk about dilemma, after Tom's post we have now held out from buying the Canons and seriously contemplating the EX1's:rolleyes:

Thanks TOM!!!:)

Now I just need to dig deeper in that pocket....I'm sure there was some spare change somewhere....

Flame1

Rob James
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Joined: Jun 26 2001

It's partly a generation thing but mainly sensor size. If the playing field is even vaguely level a good big one will beat a good little one every time. If you can live with the EX-1 workflow and the current high price of memory cards. I wouldn't even consider the Canons. There is obviously a lot more to it than this but, if picture quality is top of the list then the EX-1 and EX-3 (same guts, different presentation) walk all over the 1/3" cams with the exception of the rolling shutter problem.

Rob The picture is only there to keep the sound in sync

tom hardwick
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Colin, you say of the EX1, '... But I think it is maybe overkill for wedding work' and I'm right with you on that one - unless of course you're shooting £10k weddings all the time. Weddings are covered in electronic flashes, it's what adds to the excitement of the day. Don't buy a CMOS camera with rolling shutter until you really understand what electronic flash will do to your images, and especially so if you think you might want to slo-mo that scene in post.

And don't think for a moment you'll have time on the day itself to shoot in native slo-mo on the EX1, it just won't happen.

tom.

Flame1
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Joined: Apr 21 2007

Tom, stop messing with my head:D

We have now just put our prices up to £10,000;)

Flame1

tom hardwick
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Lol!!

colin rowe
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Tom.
As mentioned on other posts, I think the EX1 is a most amazing bit of kit. There is nothing that gets even close to it, at the price. I have used Sony cams for nearly 28 years and have never thought about changing to any other brand. But I do believe that the Canons are more versatile than Sony Z1/FX1. Just my subjective view. I dont think I will ever be caught filming slomos on the day, for the last 26 years I have shot docu style, bit long in the tooth to change now. To be honest I am probably going to hang on for a month or two and go for an EX1. As we all agree, once you have experienced this camera, and viewed its amazing picture quality, nothing else will do.

Colin Rowe

tom hardwick
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Not only the amazing picture quality Colin, but the viewfinder is wonderfully sharp - making rock 'n' roll focus an accurate possibility. Shame the Z1 doesn't allow peaking and zebras on at the same time - whoever decided on that particular spec?

The first Sony video camera I used to shoot a wedding was the plumbicon tubed, umbilical corded Betamax over the shoulder thingie. Must have been the middle of 1980. So that's 28 years of Sony shooting for me too.

tom.

tom hardwick
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I should add that in my view the EX1 is indistinguishable from the Z1 once on SD DVD, except of course in the gloom (less grainy) and in the electronic flash (half exposed frames).

Of course it's much nicer to use (viewfinder, differential focus, swivelling handle, workflow and so on) so that could well be the deal clincher even before Blu ray shows its huge superiority.

pkbristol
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Colin.
Let me know when you get the EX1.
I'll post a couple of good picture profiles on here for you.

Obviously if you get an EX1 and do a 2 cam shoot, you'd be better of working with someone who also has an EX1 ;)

Paul.

colin rowe
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Hi Paul.
Will do

Colin Rowe