steamy windows

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ducky12
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Joined: May 14 2003

what technique do I need to apply to stop the lens steaming up in bathroom type locations ?

les

Les

mooblie
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I though this was a question about video streaming for a moment. Sorry, can't help!

Martin - DVdoctor in moderation. Everyone is entitled to my opinion.

printperm
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Use cold water!

Dave R Smith
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The short answer:
Take camera into room in plastic bag or wrapped in cloth/towel and leave for 30 minutes.
(Sounds like a cooking lesson).
Upon return camera should be at same temperature as room, so little chance of condensation forming.

Longer answer:
I have had problems with canon xm2 giving erroroneous 'condensation warning' which causes camera to shut down. Problem now fixed for £250 but still leaves me nervous.

If on a commercial shoot, I would advise leaving high humidity shots till end of day.
If condensation gets in camera it can take 24 hours to dry out and can't use camera in meantime.

I also suggest camera is placed in plastic sealed bag after use with silica gel crystal sachet, then leave outside bag at room temperature for a day.

Maybe this is over-reacting, but when you have been caught out in the past it makes you nervous. I also tend to use spare camera for risky shots.

I would also suggest you get your gorlfriends consent before you put her pictures on the web! ;-)

Dave.

rbarry
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If you're camera happens to be one of those listed with Sony CCD's that can fail when subjected to a combination of high temperatures and high humidity, then be very careful!!

Alan Roberts
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Taking any video camera into a steamy environment is asking for trouble. If you get condensation inside, it can shred the tape as it sticks to the drum, so most tape-based cameras have humidity sensors that will stop you engaging the tape. Even if you get it up to the environmental temperature and humidity, you're running the risk, but if you really have to, then a very light smear of vaseline on the front element will stop that surface steaming up. Remember to clean it off afterwards though.

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ducky12
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thanks for all the info.
All I can say is Dave your imagination is running riot "I would also suggest you get your gorlfriends consent before you put her pictures on the web! ;-)"

Alan you have give me the answer " a very light smear of vaseline "

Off the initial query but I was just remembering when my wife an I were putting together a doc which involved filming from a pontoon in a marina. I was on cam she was holding mike. Suddenly the pontoon lurched and she dropped the mike in the water I'm sure I could here the fishes laughing in my cans. But the best bit was the mike still worked for years after.

les

Les

Mad_mardy
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as has been said i'd be more concerned about the humidity affecting the inside of the camera more than the lens. most camera's state the maximum humidity they can be subjected to.
i think the cold water idea is the best , steam from the water created with some dry ice with a steamy room effect created with a fog or mist machine

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Alan Roberts
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The "industry" uses chemical smoke machines, any "Special Effects" supplier can hire you the machine and a few canisters.

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Cougar
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I had this problem years ago when I was filming down the Channel Tunnel, while it was being built. I kept having to wipe the lens. We used Betacam the first time, but used 16mm film thereafter as there were no heads to gum up.

infocus
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Mad_mardy wrote:
i think the cold water idea is the best , .............

But does the actor/actress in the bath.........?

More seriously, make sure the camera is warm before taking it into the room, and/or leave it to acclimatise for a period before attempting to use it, and I'd suggest in extreme cases with no tape in. The worst I've encountered was the opening of the Eden Project - cold outside, very hot and humid within. The cameras had to be taken in well in advance, and were just left for a long time before used - after that all was fine. Another crew took his camera straight in, tried to use it straight away, and then had a big problem with tape stuck round the head drum.

That's the most serious potential problem. Second worst is condensation forming INSIDE the lens - I know from experience (fortunately not too often) that I will have problems if my camera gets very wet, is then put away like that in a warm environment (even for the drive to next location), then taken somewhere colder. It takes hours to recover. Least serious is front element/UV filter steaming up - that should cure itself fairly quickly.

Alan Roberts
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The film industry normally uses water at below room temperature, for exactly this reason, the visual steam is actually chemical smoke. Actors (good ones) are perfectly capable of making it look real. Remember the final scene in Terminator 2, where Arnie descends into molten metal? That whole scene was shot in disused unheated premises in winter, very cold, the molten metal was CGI, the actors just acted hot. That's what they do. In the same way, Carry On Camping was shot in Wales in a clod snap, so cold that the grass was brown and had to be painted, but Babs Windsor still managed to look hot in a bikini.

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Mad_mardy
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Alan Roberts wrote:
The film industry normally uses water at below room temperature, for exactly this reason, the visual steam is actually chemical smoke. Actors (good ones) are perfectly capable of making it look real. Remember the final scene in Terminator 2, where Arnie descends into molten metal? That whole scene was shot in disused unheated premises in winter, very cold, the molten metal was CGI, the actors just acted hot. That's what they do. In the same way, Carry On Camping was shot in Wales in a clod snap, so cold that the grass was brown and had to be painted, but Babs Windsor still managed to look hot in a bikini.

exactly, you can't have your cake and eat it

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Dave R Smith
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Sorry to contradict you Alan, but the Terminator is a Cyborg not an actor.
If fake molten metal was used, then the Terminator wouldn't melt and you'd probably have Terminator 3 and... oh....mmm

Chrome
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I refused to film in a sauna recently for a corporate client for exactly the resons stated above. I explained that if they would drain the baths and fill them with cooler water and we utilised 'fake' steam that it was possible, however the cost of doing that put them off. They were fine in the end as they understood that I would not want to risk my equipment (and also compromise the rest of their production). We were outside the UK and finding replacements may not have been easy if there was a problem.

Alan Roberts
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Dave, you knew exactly what I meant, and the Terminators, once stripped to the skeleton were pure CGI. So there :p

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infocus
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Next you know Alan will be saying they use computer effects on Dr Who, and that the Tardis doesn't really travel through time and space.

Alan Roberts
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Now, would I?

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tom hardwick
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In the original Terminator (1985) presumably the skeletons were animinatronic mechanical marvels, yes?

tom.

Dave R Smith
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This is ridulous, next you'll be telling me politicians are actors.

Dave.

Alan Roberts
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You've not been watching "In The Thick Of It" then? :D

An IBC I was at, early 80s, showed me just how much CGI there was in the movie industry even then. One facilities house, with bases in Soho and California, was regularly (daily) transmitting data between their bases at a rate that would otherwise have required a continuous flow of D1 tapes (the only reliable uncompressed video format then available, but used for data (4k) rather than video) of 6 per hour, non-stop, each way. In some productions the load was so heavy that they had to resort to sending data tapes in flight cases every night. The amount of grunt they had was stupendous, even then they were talking of using 20 TB storage for a feature, that amount hasn't changed with time, but the size of the kit has shrunk, they now do on arrays of Linux PCs what used to need a big mainframe, Cray style.

Get my test cards document, and cards for 625, 525, 720 and 1080. Thanks to Gavin Gration for hosting them.
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Unicorn
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Quote:
Next you know Alan will be saying they use computer effects on Dr Who, and that the Tardis doesn't really travel through time and space.

Nah, the Beeb couldn't afford all that CGI, it was cheaper just to build a time machine.

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Alan Roberts
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Early on, Dr.Who effects weren't CGI, they were real tv, done with real cameras and models and glass shots.

Get my test cards document, and cards for 625, 525, 720 and 1080. Thanks to Gavin Gration for hosting them.
Camera settings documents are held by Daniel Browning and at the EBU
My book, 'Circles of Confusion' is available here.
Also EBU Tech.3335 tells how to test cameras, and R.118 tells how to use the results.

Unicorn
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Don't forget the bubble-wrap! I was amused a while back when I watched one of the stories from the 70s which really scared me as a kid and discovered that the monster was just a guy with bubble-wrap taped on him and painted green...

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infocus
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I remember the first ever appearance of the Daleks (must have been all of 12 years ago, as I was 9 at the time......;) ) and then "Blue Peter" announcing that next week they'd be showing you how to build your own. Result: a lot of disenchanted children at school the day after that, realising that far from terrorising anybody met in the street they wouldn't take long to recognise the eggboxes and cardboard.